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Do You Think There is God?
Posted by Ging • 1/06/08 • Subscribe to this Discussion [RSS] • Report This Topic
Tags: Belief, God, Religious
If you think there is God, explain it and if there is none, explain it too.
User Comments
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I believe there is a God (I am an Orthodox Christian).
I believe there is a God as while there is alot of trauma in this world we live, there is also alot of miracles that happen every day.
There is a higher being that helps us everyday, this higher being to me is God. Even though the hardships I and others have endured he has always carried us on his hands so we have come through them okay.
Some may say that there is no God and that you make your own destiny, I say that you make your own destiny but God helps you through your chosen path.
God means something different to a lot of people, to me he is a guiding light it making sure I follow a path where I can say that I have achieved good in this world and a path where I know that what ever happens he is here to help me.
P.S I always where my silver cross which has been blessed by Monks in Bulgaria when I leave home and it makes me feel safe.-
@ garydenness, when I was younger doing work in Houston, Fulbright & Jaworski pushed hard for me to go into law. They said I was a natural. And later, working in Washington, one of the most outstanding lawyers in Virginia pressed me hard saying I had one of the best minds he'd ever seen for the profession. I didn't and, had I, I'd be very well to do today. On the other hand, I knew a brilliant man who was far from being religious say, 'There must be a hell, because there're lawyers on earth'. I think I made the right decision :-) -
god is a jar of milk:)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=jk6ILZAaAMI -
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@skvnet
What an answer!!!
Do you like a black eye? I can give u many. Wish u r right infront of me. -
@weblogian
Do you usually give blackeyes on someone you met who has different faith than you?
wastedwisdom.blogspot.com/2008/06/imagine.html
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No,
In all seriousness, if I believed in the Judeo-Christian God I would feel compelled to also believe in elves, fairies, unicorns, all the Indian Gods, Zeus, Apollo, kitsune, gnomes, and a million other things since the evidence for each of their existences is identical.-
interesting point of view. except that there was once a guy called Jesus that claimed he was God, died and rose again. many people met him and wrote about him.
i'm not sure anyone met the rest of the people you mentioned. -
Jesus never claimed He was God. The closest He got was to say, "No one comes to the Father but through Me." He never proclaimed Himself God, or the Savior. -
Meanna, what writing are you talking about? If you mean the Bible, then I have to accept the Bhagavad Gita, Bahai Texts, Buddhist Texts, Enuma Elish, Ethiopian Texts, The Egyptian Book of the Dead, Hindu Texts, Islamic Texts, Jain Texts, Mormon Texts (Church of Jesus Christ), Nag Hammadi Texts, Pistis Sophia, Taoist Texts, Sepher Yetzirah, Shinto Texts, Sikh Texts, Tibetan Book of the Dead, Urantia Book, Zen Texts, and the Zoroastrian Texts. Frankly, my brain can't hold all that.
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Hi ghostytwofish
refarding Jesus saying he was (is) God:
>> John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."
>> John 17:5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.
Those are just a couple of verses. Hope they make sense. -
Very little in the bibel makes an awful lot of sense. To believe you have made sense of it in any literal way requires a vivid interpretation, a liberal sprinkling of intepretation and quite often a lifetime's worth of brainwashing.
To believe in the bibel as a literal account is, in my opinion, to be a complete moron. To believe in it as a message of some sort? Cool. If that's your cup of tea. But again...why not then choose any of a multitude of fictional books that can explain how to live your life. Even better, why not just study law? -
Hi garydenness
Interesting points there. When you say why not study Law instead of the Bible, are you refering to the Law that came from the Bible? -
Techfun, to feel that compelled is definitely a compulsion to avoid :-)
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@ MeannaBlog
">> John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."
>> John 17:5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began. "
Yes, perfect sense. Being Hindu, I can happily make the same statements.
Aren't you one with God? Didn't you exist before the world began?
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I believe there are higher beings, but because I believe there are higher beings.
I can not prove it, or disprove it. Statistically, whether god exists or not does not influence our actions anyway. -
I personally don't believe there is a God, which in some circles makes me an atheist, based on a loose, but common, usage of the term. I do not KNOW there is no God, and frankly, I don't believe anyone else does either, which in some circles makes me agnostic.
If you've ever seen 1 Giant Leap, there's a great interview with Mike Oldfield, in which he likens God to a magician (purely metaphor, he's not trying to be insulting). A magician doesn't want to reveal his tricks, and so couldn't we imagine God also doesn't want us to know how it was all done? Maybe there's a reason we have different definitions for "faith" and "knowledge".
I don't find a belief in God (for any value of God) to be simplistic, foolish or worthless. We all have a need to express wonder with the Universe, and with the fact we find ourselves part of it. A faith in the Divine is one of the ways in which people express this wonder. -
I believe in God. I'm Catholic. As for proof... there's a book called A Case for a Creator.
Think about it. Where did this universe come from? All the scientific theories in the world don't really answer that. They all assume something being present at the beginning, like the idea of some super-dense substance that exploded in the Big Bang. But where did that something come from? And why is there so much order in the universe? If it was all random chance wouldn't things be rather more chaotic? Sure, it's complex, but orderly.
Jesus was also a real person. There's historical evidence for Him.
I could go on, but I have a feeling I've already said enough to make a few people here angry.-
brigid: Regardless of my personal beliefs, or lack thereof, I definitely find the words of Christ inspiring!
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There is also Much More historical evidence for John the Baptist... and that the church had to suppress and incorporate his followers who believed that JB was the real Messiah. -
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Well, it's true that there's little beyond the one paragraph is Josephus' Antiquities of the Jews. That's if you discount the entirety of the New Testament, the earliest copies of which date back fairly close to when Jesus lived. We should have such evidence for all known historical figures.
I'm not really sure where you're coming from with that stuff about John the Baptist. I heard that allegation once before, but with very little hard evidence to back it up. -
brigid: as far as I know, the earliest copies of NT books originate around 300 AD with the First Council of Nicea. Are there earlier copies, and who has them now?
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Well, I am fairly certain that is the first complete copy, yes. There have been fragments that date back much earlier. I think most scholars (though I could be wrong) agree that the earliest books were written toward the end of the 1st century of the beginning of the 2nd.
So it's possible that people within living memory of Jesus wrote those books. -
Actually, no. There is NO historical proof that Jesus existed.
The authors of The Bible (No. God did not write it!) were among the world’s first plagiarists, borrowing from myths older than themselves to create the mythical figure they called Jesus Christ.
Almost all the events of the supposed life of Jesus appear in the lives of other mythical figures of far more ancient origin. Nearly all such 'signs' had been ascribed to other gods, centuries before any Jewish holy man strolled about. Christ’s supposed utterances and wise statements are equally commonplace, being variously stolen from Jewish scripture, neo-Platonic philosophy or commentaries made by Stoic and Cynic sages.
Here are five fictional gods who served as the basis for the mythical Jesus Christ:
Three thousand years before the Alleged Christ, there was the mythical Egyptian savior known as Horus. He was born of a virgin on December 25 in a manger with his birth being announced by a star in the East and attended by three wise men. At 12, he was a child teacher in the Temple, and at 30, he was baptized in the river Jordan by "John the Baptist". He had 12 disciples, two of whom were his "witnesses.” He performed miracles. Horus walked on water. He delivered a "Sermon on the Mount". He was crucified between two thieves, buried for three days in a tomb, and resurrected. - He was also described at the time as the "Way, the Truth, the Light," "Messiah," "God's Anointed Son," "the "Son of Man," the "Good Shepherd," the "Lamb of God," the "Word made flesh," the "Word of Truth," etc. - He was "the Fisherman" and was associated with the Fish. - Horus was called "the KRST," or "Anointed One." - Like Jesus, "Horus was supposed to reign one thousand years."
Next, just twelve hundred years before the alleged Christ, there was the mythical Greek god named Attis.
Attis was born on December 25 of the Virgin Nana. He was considered the savior who was slain for the salvation of mankind. His body as bread was eaten by his worshippers. His priests were "eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven." He was both the Divine Son and the Father. On "Black Friday," he was crucified on a tree, from which his holy blood ran down to redeem the earth. He descended into the underworld. After three days, Attis was resurrected on March 25 (the same day later claimed for Jesus) and called the "Most High God."
Also twelve hundred years before the alleged Christ, there was the mythical Persian god, Mithra.
Mithra was born of a virgin on December 25 in a cave, and his birth was attended by shepherds bearing gifts. He had 12 companions or disciples. He performed miracles. Mithra sacrificed himself for world peace. He was buried in a tomb and after three days rose again. His resurrection was celebrated every year. His sacred day was Sunday, the "Lord's Day," hundreds of years before the appearance of Christ. His religion had a Eucharist or "Lord's Supper," at which Mithra said, "He who shall not eat of my body nor drink of my blood so that he may be one with me and I with him, shall not be saved."
Then, just nine hundred years before the alleged Christ, there was Krishna in India.
Krishna was born of the Virgin Devaki ("Divine One") on December 25. His earthly father was a carpenter. He died around the age of 30 on a tree, crucified between two thieves. He rose from the dead and ascended to heaven. He was deemed the "Son of God" and "our Lord and Savior," who came to earth to die for man's salvation.
One more. Just five centuries before the alleged Christ, there was Dionysus, a Greek god. Dionysus was born of a virgin on December 25 and, as the Holy Child, was placed in a manger. He was a traveling teacher who performed miracles. He was the God of the Vine, and turned water into wine. Dionysus rose from the dead on March 25. He was considered the "Only Begotten Son," Savior," “Redeemer," "Sin Bearer," Anointed One."
And, of course, we all know the story of Jesus Christ because we just read it FIVE times.
The earliest defenders of an earthly flesh and blood historical Jesus came along in the 2nd century, and even at that time none of them was able to provide proof for the existence of Jesus, instead they relied on theological reasoning and scriptures to support their claims, eventually winning out through political force, not the validity of their claims. -
I could provide proof, but it's apparent that you wouldn't believe it. Too bad. There's an entire world you're blinding yourself to.
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Brigid, you could provide absolutely no proof of god whatsoever. Historical evidence for the existence of Jesus is scant to say the least. You have stumbled into the oldest 'excuses' for god known - god of the gaps. "Look at what we don't know - it must be god".
There is ample evidence that does prove that mankind invents religious beliefs. There is ample evidence that shows bibel stories have been passed to christianity from other religions.
Why is there so much order in the universe? We're going down the 'chance' road are we? According to Dumbski of the DI, god is proven because the chances of the universe being as it is by chance is too great for it to be possible. Sadly for him, the chances of me playing the two games of chess that I just played, in the exact way I just played them produces an even bigger number. I must be god. Please send letters of adoration, and cheques made payable to God to P.O. Box 114, London.
Of course the fact that I am 'intelligent' partially negates my argument. The fact that beetles places on a board could reproduce it, eventually, holds it up.
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I searched BC discussion tags for "God" and came up with with more than a page's worth of entries: www.blogcatalog.com/discuss/tag/God . I'm not a fan of these threads (quite the opposite), but some people here are.-
*nods*
Not sure why techfun dragged this topic up from the dirty BC vaults. -
Thomas: I didn't notice its age. It was on the Related Discussions thing. As far as why I commented, I'm still a bit freaked out that a religious extremist who has suggested quarantining people who are HIV positive has won the Republican caucus in Iowa.
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Aye. A bit scary. I don't care what his religion is, but some of his stances are a bit over the top.
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techfun: I share your concern. Very scary.
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lol
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I believe there is a God.
Being Hindu, I use that religion to describe, in terms that I understand and can agree with, what God is to me. However, I also recognize that God is many things to many other people, some of which do not see eye to eye with what I think God is.
God is not limited by my beliefs, or my religion. In fact, I may be completely wrong concerning my beliefs of Him - but, more likely, my beliefs are simply inaccurate and fall short of the truth. Even atheism is, in a way, a path to truth, and therefore a path to God. So is every faith that has ever existed on Earth.
God is not limited by anything. God is a concept that has existed in every empire, every race, every creed, every culture since the dawn of man. Although God changes from place to place and time to time, there has never been a time when He (or She, or It) did not enter the mind of man in some form.
God, Brahman, is beyond my mental grasp. I cannot imagine Him, and neither can you. He is all of reality, and transcendent of reality. He is all of time, and beyond time. He is you, and I - and beyond us both.
That is God to me. Brahman, as Isvara so I can grasp Him. Isvara is a way of saying as Vishnu so I can talk to Him, as Ganesha so I can ask of Him, as Arjuna so I can learn from Him, as Subhadra so I may marvel at her beauty, a thousand times over.
God is Jesus, and Mohammad, and Buddha, and the Great White Spirit. God shows himself in the Bible, the Torah, the Quran, the Vedas, and every work of man and every thing in nature. Nothing exists outside of God.
Isvara is just another way to look at Brahman because I cannot possibly see God as He in all his glory actually is. It would be like trying to look at the universe, and all of time, and all possible times, all at once.
And yet ... as much as God is unfathomable, God is also unmistakable. We look at physics and see that the evidence shows that the universe must have started as a single point, a Big Bang. What caused that point, that singularity, to burst forth into matter and energy? We don't know. Logic - causality - dictates it didn't happen by itself, so ... what, then?
We look at genetics. Mankind shares it's genome not just with apes of 5 million years ago, but with reptiles 50 million years ago. The same genes, the same receptors and insertions, used and reused since life began. Why? Did a molecule as complex and life-guiding as DNA happen by chance? Yes - but what other chance was there? None. Any good biochemist can tell you that.
The universe, then - on purpose? No, we have no evidence for the hand of God. Which is good. You can believe He is there, not not. The choice is yours - but it does make the singularity, the promotion of DNA, quantum probability and a host of other quandaries much easier to handle. An intelligent scientist does not discard a hypothesis simply because there is no physical evidence to support it, as any theoretical physicist worth his term at Cambridge knows.
Brahman. The all-pervading spirit, the One, the All, the Everything ... including me. Including you.
That is God to me.-
That was awesome! Thanks for sharing it.
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That was very good, indeed. The challenge then is obviously not to understand God, since that must be forever beyond the grasp of conceptual mind, but to experience God. That had happened to people through all times as well. What this means to those who did can also not be understood by the conceptual mind. Experience is individual and personal. -
Good piece. Nicely put across!
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To me, god is a term given to represent the laws of nature. As for an entity "God"? No. And there is no Santa Clause either. Still researching the easter bunny. I'll get back with you on that. -
The idea of getting something from nothing makes no sense. How did everything get here if nobody made it?
DNA is close to apes because we are all made from the same "stuff" It does not prove God didn't design the entire thing. Scientist use that excuse all the time but it doesn't prove anything.
It's not like if God made everything here he would make us from DNA and animals from straw. Everything is made from the same stuff so we should be very close to animals.-
The idea of getting something from nothing makes no sense. How did everything get here if nobody made it?
-- Ah, and thus another love with theoretical physics blossoms.
DNA is close to apes because we are all made from the same "stuff" It does not prove God didn't design the entire thing. Scientist use that excuse all the time but it doesn't prove anything.
-- Science isn't about proving things, it's about disproving things. Things that cannot be disproven must be. And, good science always brings more questions than it answers. By the way, while our DNA is close to what chimpanzees have, it is not close to plants, or 99.98% or the rest of the living things on this planet. This doesn't prove God designed, or didn't design, anything. What it does prove is that receptors and insertions are the same in every carbon-based, DNA-inhereant life form.
It's not like if God made everything here he would make us from DNA and animals from straw. Everything is made from the same stuff so we should be very close to animals.
-- We are. In fact, we share more similarities with animals than differences because of that DNA structure. However, DNA is not the end-all of human creation. Nurture, which turns genes on and off throughout life, is just as responsible for our genetic strength as a species as the genes themselves are. There is no nature vs. nurture - it's a nature AND nurture thing. -
Science knows (and tells me) that there are electrons and what the speed of light is. I would be foolish to reject that knowledge. Science also tells me, with just as much assurance, that living things have evolved. I know that knowledge has been tested, tried, experimented with, and applied to real situations, and has proven its "fitness" by growing stronger through 150 years of severe testing. I would be foolish to reject that knowledge.
So no, I don't believe in evolution; I KNOW that it has happened and still does. As a matter of fact, I should probably feel insulted. If you asked me if I believe the Earth is round, that would be insulting. Do you think I could be so ignorant as to believe it is flat? The same goes for evolution. Do you think I would reject the last two centuries of scientific progress and the evidence of my own eyes? I should be thoroughly offended. -
I am delighted to say that I have avoided the "progress" of Darwinian Evolutionary "Science" and remain in the reality where men and women can know God and believe that because He is a God of order, therefore the world can be understood through observation (Science).
I have participated in hours of conversation, pages of blogging, and years of observing people. I still haven't seen a persuasive reason to believe that life originated by any "evolutionary" process or that any "evolutionary" process caused the differentiation of that life into modern day species.
I don't have enough faith to believe that life or species came into being via Natural Selection or any other Evolutionary Mechanism.
:-)
ThirstyJon
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long time ago god and christ are fake phrophets sp that it will gain the public order,people go churches they obey religions to cover up the real truth of the first civlization in this planet in a secret place the book of knwoledge is head i say no more-
Good, because I would have to take up a discussion with someone who believes human history is only as old as churches. That would be very difficult to say the least.
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lol i said first civlization on planet that fish doesnt mean churches were at same time you havent really got a good sense have you
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Of course there is, you silly. I'm not intellectually capable of explaining his existence, however.
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No. I don't think there is a God.
I know there is a God.
I know this from what I have seen before I knew anything, and from what I have been shown, and what I have been told.
God cannot be thought. God can only be known.
And I also know there is a celestial existence as close to us as breath that revers, honors, and worships Him.
I know God cannot be known well, easily or at all because of thoughts, ego, or internal conflict.
Yet, anyone ready to walk a road of stones will know Him, and when this is achieved nothing on earth will weigh him down or own him ever again. Nothing.
And when His love glows and swells from within, from the inner center out, nothing will ever look the same again. Nothing.-
Isn't it a tad arrogant to say that people who doesn't believe in your god have a big ego or have an internal conflict?
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Jungl have you broke your resolution again this year -
.ink. isn't saying that. Only that it's difficult to get to know God because ego and such get in the way. Even those who believe in the same God will have that difficulty, it's part of the human condition.
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You contradict yourself. You say, "I know God cannot be known well, easily, or at all" but then you profess to not think there is a god, but to know there is a god, and go on to sound very knowledgable on the subject in which you said before, "I know God cannot be known well, easily, or at all".
How is it that you can say that god can't be known at all, and then say with great confidence that you know god?
You also say, "God cannot be thought. God can only be known."
and the hole gets deeper...
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I'm not sure, how to explain that? -
To those that do not believe no proof is possible to those that do believe no proof is necessary-
What about 50-50? Wanna believe but hard sometimes?
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You are right. It is a sound thought. It is perfect.
Belief is semantic. Thoughts are semantic. Belief is a concept. It begins and ends in itself. It mirrors itself. No matter what the belief is, this is so. Belief is irrelevant to the truth. Even when it matches a truth all agree on.
There is no proof. There is no proof for any transcendent truth. There never will be. There are things that cannot be subordinated to logic. Even in common everyday living.
There is a reality that cannot be captured or encapsulated in or by vocabulary and structured thought. I cannot put into words the experience of the beauty of a field of wild flowers, nor can I put into words the beauty of the experiences of the transcendent, celestial, and God.
Those who have traveled the 'road' come back to say what they've seen, what they've experienced. Some will believe, others will not. But the experiences and knowledge of the traveler remain true.
And if belief must have a role in the matter of God, then it is proper to say that one's disbelief is proof there is a God. If one is truly rational, truly intelligent, this will make sense. If one is stunt-clever, it will not. Such a person will waste their lives in opposition to the truth. And such a person will not know God. -
To those that do not believe no proof is possible to those that do believe no proof is necessary...
I don't know about that. If there were some realistic evidence other than Dogma written by human beings that showed some real, tangible evidence of a God, I doubt many people would be denying the existence of God. The problem is that there isn't ANY. -
antibarbie, reread both posts. humbly, you have demonstrated what is written.
jungl, there's a misunderstanding from that para; please review the post again.
(It is 4am; I must retire) -
aliasinkhorn:
Both of your posts come off as smug and condescending. Everyone who doesn't believe what you do is wrong. Ok, gotcha. Now go spew your defunct logic elsewhere. -
antibarbie: I think I'd like to marry you.
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No way, I saw her first.
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Well, ok. And I am batting for the other team. Still, can I marry her metaphorically?
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antibarbie, thank you.
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Unfettered: I have nothing against sharing in that case, but, ah, better see what *she* thinks.
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I wish I could remember which Greek philosopher it was who looked at the order of the visible world and concluded that a higher intelligence was responsible for its creation.
The concept of this supreme being he came up with was a lot different from the Judeo-Christian concept, but it's still very interesting.
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Mathematically, life cannot be by accident.
Take a pile of house building material and place it on a hill.
How long will it be until it randomly produces a house?
Well, human life is far more complex than a house, so how long would it take to accidentally create human life?
We know Darwin was out to lunch (although prehistoric academia still sells his rather alcoholic haze concept), so what else could it be.
oh, but make no mistake about it. The god has NOTHING to do with religion, or christianity, or any of that "do this or go to hell" bunk. You need "hell" in christianity to necessitate "heaven". other than that, the collection plate would always be empty, and the churches could never get painted or renovated. certainly the Pope would not be wearing gold and silk.
By the way, if I were Christ, and I came back here, the Pope is the first guy I would have to settle up with. Babies starving in the streets, countries impoverished and starving, and he is living like a king. Time to pay up mister.
Fear sells, and religion keeps buying.
I prefer spiritualism myself. :>)
This is fun!-
Actually, when considering biochemistry and genetics, it's not a case of randomly piling bricks at all. Proteins work with DNA receptors one way, and only one way. This boils all the way down to the very structure of DNA, which is, for all intents and purposes, a protein factory.
So, it's not so much randomly piling bricks until you get a house, but that, in this case, the bricks can only form houses when piled. -
Precisely. And not only that, but where did such specialized bricks come from? I know analogies have their limits, but to extend it a bit the building materials had to come from somewhere, too.
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Yes, bricks are a bad example. Puzzle pieces are better. Proteins fit into genetic receptors when they fold into the right pattern. Proteins that fold into the wrong pattern don't fit, and those that fold into the right ones, do.
That's really all there is to it as far as the switching on and off of genetic traits goes, chemically (there's much more than that, of course, but it isn't chemical). The only pieces that fit are, well, the ones that fit.
The ones that don't have no effect on the genome in that organism at that time. Since proteins can fold into those "wrong" patterns, however, even after many millions of years of evolution, it stands that uses for them must exist elsewhere in nature - just not for those particular receptors. -
Creationists are fundamentalist Christians who believe that the account of creation in the Book of Genesis is literally true. According to creationists, the Earth is only about 6,000 years old, Adam and Eve were the actual ancestors of all living people, and Noah´s flood occurred exactly as described in the Bible.
Creationists ignore the basic premises of science. -
What does that have to do with what we're talking about? We're talking about Intelligent Design, not Creationism. There's a big difference.
Creationism assumes that the Genesis account is literally true word for word.
Intelligent Design assumes a creator of the universe but acknowledges that the Genesis account is more allegorical than literal.
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Yes..i believe in God.
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Perhaps the only thing more absurd than a bearded man living in the air above us who knows everything we think, say or do, is the ridiculous concept of God answering prayer, interceding in basketball games or influencing disaster.
We’re sick of hearing basketball players say, "I'd like to thank my lord and savior, Jesus Christ for winning this game." Didn’t see Jesus out there on the court. Besides, he’s too short to play basketball.
You hear it on award shows, when rappers win. “Thanks for this award for “Hos With Big Booties” I gotta give props to my main man, Jesus. He supports me in everything I do.” Even the cocaine?
If we believed what evangelicals told us, God flooded many areas in the US recently as punishment for our immoral society. According to the Reverend Graham Dow, a leading evangelical, “This is a strong and definite judgment because the world has been arrogant in going its own way.” He blames the God-sent disaster on three things: God’s pissed that we are ruining the environment, God’s upset with our wide-spread greed, and of course, God hates gays.
We must point out that God, himself, is obviously gay. Think about it. Unmarried for 6,000 years. Allows a human woman to have his only son. Always wears white robes.
Remember, natural disasters kill and injure indiscriminately. Everyone was affected whether or not they were believers or non-believers, moral or immoral, straight or gay. An all-powerful and righteous God would be more targeted in his wrath.
Any natural disaster can be interpreted as judgment from God. Just yesterday, lightning struck a Baptist Church in Baltimore. The resulting fire utterly demolished the building. Apparently God hates Baptists as much as he hates gays.
If God punishes behavior of which he disapproves, it is reasonable to suppose that he rewards behavior of which he approves. In the Western World, our life-expectancy and quality of life have undergone enormous improvements over the last few centuries. This must be a reward from God because Western society has become much less religious and more rational.
That’s it! God is rewarding us for being Rational Thinkers. What other explanation can there be for our prosperity and comfort?
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Thou shalt not kill.
Kill people?
Kill bugs?
Kill time?
How about kill this discussion?
Wouldn't that be a sin too?
The commandment is not specific.
;>)-
I believe the correct translation is "Thou shalt not murder", which only goes to prove that any grouping of crows is inherently evil
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The term, taken from the Hebrew, specifically referred to killing people. (I wish I had my Jewish Bible here, but I think my brother has it.) Ancient Jews killed stuff all the time - including each other and their enemies, long after the tablets were handed down.
The reason for those commandments wasn't that God expected man to follow them - in fact, it was a losing proposition and God knew it. It was to show that no matter how hard man tried, he could never be perfect enough to satisfy God. Which brings in the perfect sacrifice of Jesus on our behalf, and thus why he's the savior, etc etc.
In that light, the commandments make perfect sense.
Unfettered, on the ball again. -
Very well stated ghostly. You can have the stage all day as far as I'm concerned.
Oops - I put this in the wrong spot - this was in response to the Free Will/Destiny post you made below. My bad!
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now ghosty as that is proven i agree with you on that alot of effort goes into to it
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I don't think.
It's overrated. -
i dont know if i would believe that their is GOd or Not!
i am still confuse on his existence!
because for me we the people is the one who makes our own fate!-
Ah, tarius007, you touch on one of my favorite topics. I love the fate conundrum. I personally believe that free will is an illusion, one that is meant to teach us on intellectual and spiritual levels. Many people believe that free will is the ultimate shaper of one's reality, and of the cosmos itself. It's my favorite debating ground.
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i personally believe that Reality is an illusion.
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Buddhist?
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no... but i could be. Buddhism is a lot less intellectually confining than modern day christianity.
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ghosty - your posts are fascinating. Screw the debate - I'd just love to hear more of your thoughts on free will vs destiny. I've always found that fascinating and quite a "conundrum" indeed.
Me personally, I believe in god (raised Catholic). I also believe in evolution. I believe that we were intelligently designed to be able to adapt/mutate/naturally select and ultimately evolve.
I love science, but I've never heard a worthwhile explanation for how the elements and proto elements that supposedly existed in the instant just before the big bang came to be. What (or perhaps more correctly "who") begot them?
Interesting topic in my opinion. -
Oh man, don't ever offer me a stage. It's just not wise.
I can give you an idea of where I'm coming from with free will, though. The universe is set up to the present moment - any other choices have branched off in their separate time lines before this, so where "we" are is where we are. From here, it's forks in the road all the way - what if I do this, what if someone else does that.
The problem I had for a long time was with those forks. I couldn't ever concieve of a moment when I'd create a fork of my own - rather, the possibility is always there, and whether I take that turn or not might simply depend on whether I see the turn for myself.
So, I have to assume that, since all possibilities lay before me, that God, who created me and knows me better than I know myself, knows which fork I am going to take ahead of time.
It's like the Oracle told Neo: Knowing what choices are going to be made isn't what's important. Knowing WHY those choices are made is. -
At the same time that Christians claim to worship God as an omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent being, they make him out to be incompetent bumbler. Or worse. Simple forgiveness is beyond his capacities. God must "sacrifice himself to himself to change a rule he made himself!"
This is not only an absurdity, it is an essential absurdity. It is present in almost all forms of Christianity, and one can scarcely remove it and remain a Christian in anything but name. By definition, all Christians worship Christ - in some form - and most worship him as a saviour.
But what, exactly, is he saving us from? Though it varies from church to church, no matter what they call it, it's God himself. A hell created by God, a world fallen as a result of God's negligence, a separation from God imposed... by God.
Christianity certainly isn't the first religion to promote appeasement of its gods, and if it were merely another supernatural protection racket, it would be bad enough. Unfortunately, it doesn't stop there. Christians elevate appeasement to the realm of "personal relationship", transforming their religion into a true monstrosity.
This is the type of "relationship" that abused wives have with their husbands, that brainwashed hostages have with their captors. It is known in clinical circles as Stockholm Syndrome. Should it come as any surprise that the cries of the church, "The Bride of Christ" sound much like the cries of an abused wife attempting to protect her husband?
"He must beat me."
"I deserve it."
"He has no choice."
"It's for my own good."
These excuses don't work for human abusers, and they work even less well for God. For if God is omnipotent, he must have a choice. And if we are flawed, we are only flawed because that is the way he made us. (No excuses that we ruined his perfect creation. A truly perfect creation does not self-destruct.)
If the Christian God does exist - and I see no reason to believe that he does - he's not worthy of the name.
And that is the ultimate absurdity of Christianity.
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I do believe in God. -
I believe in Snuffleupagus. Why? muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Mr._Snuffleupagus
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I forgot all about that character. I used to watch SS all the time with my cousins.
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free will is achievable in both senses you have pointed yet it seems not to happen alot many great speakers have died becaus of free will yet i still think it must be put across
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i think god has been created by us the mankind and has made alot of people fight and have very vivid views in which we ourselfs dont know how we really got here and we will never know unless the book of knowledge is realeased form underneath a certain location.
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the keeper of genenis is pretty good book to read
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yes evolution because destiny is in ur hands and we only use ten percent of our brains therfore imagine wot we coukld use if we had half of that it may get slighlty uncontrabble at some stage perhaps that why we only can use ten percent because if you had bad people that used alot of thier brains it would course huge problems
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you speak the text of someone else that was apparently created by the so-called god
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so the words are not to a proven state
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Finding God Within and Without
by: Author Unknown, Source Unknown
How do I find You God?
God is Love.If you have ever loved,If you have ever been loved,You have experienced Godfrom Within and Without
God is Truth.If you have ever told the truth,If you have ever discovered Truth,You have experienced God from Within and Without
God is Beauty.If you have ever helped to create something beautiful,If you have ever witnessed beauty in any of it's myriad forms,You have experienced Godfrom Within and Without
God is Good.If you have ever done or thought something good,If you have ever recognized goodness in or through another,You have experienced God from Within and Without
All of those experiences, those gifts,of Love, Truth, Beauty and Goodness were directly from God through you. or to you.
Glad to Meet You God. let's hang out together. -
I believe in an ordered universe. There is something which created the order, physics, biology underneath the universe. I think it is very similar to David Bohm's idea of Implicate Order, or a universal set of rules and states that runs through all things. I think by trying to express the idea in written religious or scientific ideology we fail to fully grasp what we are trying to comprehend.-
Well, it would be difficult to believe in an un-ordered universe. We don't happen to be in one.
It is not the order that humans would use, however. It is, by our best definition, highly regulated chaos. -
The level of complexity in the universe makes my head spin. But even without an advanced degree in quantum physics I understand the order behind the mayhem.
And the huge pile of coincidences necessary for this planet to even be suitable for life, never mind getting life started in the first place. -
Ahh, but that's the fault in the logic. It's not coincidence. It's actually the only way it COULD have come together. The complexity of the universe was the only logical way it had to work itself out. It didn't "just happen." It happened because this was the only outcome available.
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Not necessarily. Change one little thing at the starting point of the universe and something totally different could have occurred.
Yet this is how it happened.
It's the knowledge of what could have been but what actually is that's amazing.
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agian this might sway a bit of the subject but people only go to churches because they fear death.
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Eh? Since when?
That sure isn't the reason I go to church. And I go every Sunday. (Well, once in a while I go Saturday evening instead, but I do go once a week.)
Of course, I don't want to die. So to avoid that probability I eat right, look both ways before crossing the street, and don't hang out in dark alleys. I also don't leave open flames unattended.
Going to Mass has more to do with the state of my immortal soul than the death of my physical body. -
James, no.. there is no fear of death for those who believe. For those who believe, going to church is all about worshiping Him. I don't go to church out of fear. God is love and there is no fear in love.
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What are my choices? Happenstance vs Design?
I'd have to go with design.-
A lot of scientists do. Particularly those with an emphasis on cosmology and other 'big picture' fields.
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I do believe in God, in a sense. I do not however believe in God in the biblical terms. Higher power is more like it. When I think about the image of God I dont see a long haired white guy. I see everything. I believe that God embodies all this in the world. "It" can be anyone or anything. I believe "it" is all around us.
How can we believe in something (the bible) that we have no proof what so ever that its true. The bible was written by a bunch of old white guys, you dont think they changed some stuff in their favor.
I believe in a spiritual higher power because I know it is there. I can feel it.
www.ashleyallred.com-
The Hebrews were a bunch of 'old white guys'?
Now that's a new one to me.
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no human being is intelligent enough to say if there is god or no, and i don't believe any human being had any contact with god in the past, present or future, prophets are only opportunist mans with charisma but they are not god messengers or angel or god sons they are only normal human with more ability to talk to people and make them listen to them and probably smarter then the mass but their is nothing magical or spiritual about it
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You make some strong assertions there. Can you offer any evidence?
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can you prove i'm wrong? can you give me any evidence that their is god? or any prophets?
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i forget : yeah i have fate but not in a religious way! their is surely a power somewhere, a master of puppet their is something but i am not intelligent enough as human being to understand what's really behind the curtain and i'm pretty sure NO one know!! in fact we rare all ignorant and i've enough respect for life and for this so call power to not put a name on him (like god, allah, yaveh)
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Respectfully, your comment is evidence you know God. How you know God is in difference from others.
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Nicely put, alias.
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I know you from what you write tho I have no experience with you. I know there is more to know tho I don't know what it is. I have a name to identify you in talking tho that name is not you. You are nameless about everything you are but have a name to know.
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there's definitely a god but
he's either uncaring on not sentient (e.g. the universe itself may be god) -